Evan Senn: A Big Mouthed Woman with a Boy’s Name (among other things)
Evan Senn | From VoyageLa.com
“Bright and passionate curator, contemporary art historian, opinionated big-mouthed woman with a boy's name. A vegan gluten-free foodie, good wife, and mom to [two]. Southern heart in an ocean-loving moon-child. Heavily tattooed painter, poet and musician turned curator and writer. Lover of all things art, music and life-related. Passion and purpose.”
When I first met Evan Senn, I thought I was going to have to deal with a semester of angry feminist rantings. And I did. And while some of those rantings were a little excessive for me, others were delicately worded love letters to long forgotten female-identifying artists. But more than lyrical hate poetry aimed at systemic inequalities and their perpetrators, I gained things I hadn’t cared to consider previously. I had exhausted my artistic inspirations. I wasn’t excited about art anymore. It felt like everything had already been sketched and done and started to question what it was all for. I thought that this was just a matter of taste and not so much exposure since I had taken more art history classes than I cared to remember. But then, she introduced me to the Lowbrow Art movement and the gray world I was living in cracked open. You mean to tell me, that I can paint huge dicks and camel-toes just because I want to and still call it fine art? Even better, I can still call it fine art and stick it to the man by doing so? According to Robert Williams, “You’ve got a crucifix and a bottle of urine and canned feces, and [someone] doing nothing, and a pile of sand in a museum – what is left? The only thing left is wide open use of imagination.” I couldn’t believe it.
Senn’s Poster for the Mark Miller Gallery
Excited, I signed up for more of her classes. She continued to introduce me to even more wildly creative and unapologetically raw individuals that created art that resonated with me at an atomic level and who continue to inspire me today. She gave me an excuse to delve into the rich and fascinating lives of living artists who were actively relevant to my life and experiences simply for documenting the now in new and imaginative ways. And because of that, Senn has likely done much more for my personal visual art and writing than any studio class I had taken before her lectures.
An art gallery curator, writer, teacher, mother, woman, devourer of good food and music, and fellow art fetishist, Evan Senn is the perfect intersectional artist from which to gain rich insight into the inner workings of the art world. She graciously allowed me to interview her and she thoroughly and thoughtfully answered every single one of my questions on all things relating to her multiple professions as well as what it took (and continues to take) to get to where she is.
Through video, she sat us down in her charming office/studio. A spotted feline wanders about carelessly in the background. She laughs, “That’s Kora.” In a pleasant Southern California accent, she reveals that she really enjoys cats’ little paw pads; “their little beans. Especially Kora’s, because they’re pink.” When asked what her favorite body part on people is, she thinks for a moment and shrugs. “I guess I would just say: eyes. [...] I really enjoy peoples’ eyes. I used to draw them a lot when I was younger. They’re very interesting; very beautiful or unique.” She nods with enthusiastic affirmation, “I like eyes. I’d say eyes.”
This makes sense. Eyes are probably one of the surface organs she relies on the most. “Visually,” she beams, “I indulge in art. I particularly like color. My house has quite a bit of art in it and I’m very proud of the collection that I’ve acquired. Instagram of course is, like, a guilty pleasure because it also satisfies my visual hunger for cool looking shit. But, obviously, I really like thinking about art.” She looks straight into the camera. “I think it’s the saving grace of humanity.” She smiles, as if to punctuate the heavy phrase—that one knows, just by looking and hearing her say it, that she means it—with a touch of bitter-sweetness.
“I most definitely pursue my cravings. I’m kind of the type of person that if I crave something…” she pauses, “I pretty much get it. Or at least desperately try to get it.”
She figured out the “particular combination” of being a teacher, a writer, and a gallery director a couple years after graduate school. “Jobs are really hard to come by in art history… Surprise!” She laughs empathetically. “And I’ve always kind of worked in galleries part-time; I did it in college and after college and… I don’t know. There’s also just not a lot of jobs in that industry, either. I got my first teaching gig five years ago and I was like,” she shakes her head in almost disbelief, “Oh my God, this is it. This is the most fun I’ve ever had doing a job. [...] Like, it doesn’t feel like work to me…and I love that. Getting paid to do my gallery stuff is, like, a bonus.”
“And writing...professionally... I never really figured out that I wanted to do that. Somebody just started offering my jobs and then people kept on offering me jobs for writing and the next thing I knew, I was a writer...?” She looks like she can’t believe what she’s saying either. “And then, [I became] an editor of a magazine…and then the editor of a paper...and then it, I don’t know. It just kind of, like, took off on its own...trajectory.”
B GRADE CELEBRITY Collaboration with S.A. Hawkins and Evan Senn | Model: S.A. Hawkins | Photographer: Evan Senn
“I kind of had hoped that, by this point in my career, I would have had a teaching job. But that is not the case. I am an adjunct professor, so I teach at multiple schools with no security or guarantee that I’ll teach there again. And I only teach those classes during the spring and the fall semester. And, of course, that is up and down and left and right. My gallery is a little bit more stable but is not that much money. And writing, of course, is a hustle. So, to do what I do now, you have to have a graduate degree, you have to work your way up the ladder as far as working in galleries and curating shows. and then you have to get experience teaching… [at least] some classes; somewhere in order to get greater opportunities.”
“I was… I feel that I was lucky. Maybe not lucky. I had an amazing opportunity in the connections that I had made in writing and in my graduate work to then get an opportunity to teach at Cal State Fullerton and at Laguna College of Art and Design the first time I applied to them. Having those opportunities was pretty amazing and door-opening. Being able to curate is really great and my writing career helped my ability to curate because I was able to use my connections from writing articles about art to then curate shows about art using artists that, maybe, had already known about and maybe they had already known about me. So, it’s kind of a hodge-podge of things, I guess. But it took years to get to where I am. I mean, graduate school alone is, like, two years...minimum. And then, say, another four or five years of experience on top of that [and] bullshit jobs to get to this.”
“... had known my trajectory? I probably would have gotten more jobs in publications earlier. I probably would have gone for the TA positions in grad school...Maybe try to curate a little bit more in graduate school. Maybe… Maybe started applying for jobs, like the ones I have now, when I was in grad school so that I could figure out what they required because I didn’t realize [what that required specifically] until after I started applying and I didn’t start applying until years after grad school. So, I would have probably gone for a little more experience, earlier.”
Which is an understatement. She only had two months to prepare for one of her first shows. “I also wanted it to be [a] blockbuster, showstopper. I wanted to show everybody, “Guess who’s here now?” Like, “Evan’s here.” She pauses to erupt in a series of rhythmic and attention calling snaps: “Check it!” So, I did the show on tattoo art and art by tattoo-ers. It was pretty amazing. It was called, Pointed Permanence; pretty amazing show...for [having been entirely curated in] two months.
"Obviously, I would have liked to have had a few bigger name artists, but for two months [to be] put together… I think it was pretty good. This was at the Golden West College Art Gallery. [It was] not my first [art] show ever,” she clarifies, “[It was] my first show in this job as gallery director at the Golden West College Art Gallery. That was really memorable because I had to drive around to all these tattoo artists’ houses after messaging them on Instagram and convincing them to be in my show and I had to pick up all of their work. And I even convinced some of them to give me some of their tattoo machines and I put them on display in these, like, nice glass domes things and I had, like, red lights lighting the thing… It was cool. It was, I think, a good introduction and that was memorable for me. It felt… magical.”
“I would say one of my top favorite shows I curated was Femella which was my winter exhibition from just this past 2019... It was up when I gave birth to my child and it was all about representation of femininity and womanhood with an all-female artist roster. And the work was just...really cool. [It was made up of] a huge variety: abstract, figurative, representational, non-representational...all kinds of amazing stuff...installation, painting, drawing, photography… [There was] so much amazing work by amazing women that I know. And it was...powerful. And of course, I was going through such a transitional time becoming a mother...creating life inside my body and then expelling it. It was… I felt more connected to being a woman than I ever thought I would. So, that was a really beautiful show for me to have up during my transitional time in my life. And it was just a stunning show, everyone said so. Of course, it was right at the same time that the O.C. Weekly was shutting down, so nobody wrote about it… But it was a really good show.”
Senn showing off her tattoos | Photo by Tony Pinto
“There’s a kind of satisfaction that’s hard to put into words… Curating a show, for me, is a little bit like…” she looks around her studio dreamily, “... finding all of the most beautiful things in a store or in a mall or something... I don’t know…” She laughs. “Finding all the most beautiful things that you can find and then...putting them all around you in a really pretty, decorative way...so that they mean something…to you. And when other people come in, you can...show them. You know? I don’t know… Is that making sense? I used to do this at my house when I was growing up. I would decorate my room full of...” She looks around her own studio again which is, unsurprisingly, embellished with images, papers, paintings, her diploma, and other significant relics of her life, “...stuff that inspired me. Stuff that I really cared about.” She gestures to her walls. “Pictures, postcards, scraps from shows, meaningful artworks… You know, important documents—whatever; just a bunch of meaningful things collected together and an art show is like that for me...still! It’s a little like show and tell...with really cool shit.
“Teaching, though, is a really different experience. There’s a satisfaction with teaching...that I’ve never found anywhere else. You get to communicate your own feelings and thoughts to a bunch of people that literally want to know them! And you get to talk about other people’s feelings and thoughts that have maybe influenced you or made you think about stuff. You get to deal with humanity and history and help other people kind of… grow and learn and change and become who they are supposed to be [and] with certain knowledge. And that’s...really cool. It’s really lovely to feel influential… even if it’s to one or two people. I’ve always loved my teachers. […] Teachers are meaningful and they can really make a difference in peoples’ lives and I think that’s really special. So, that kind of satisfaction...” she smiles, almost guiltily, “it’s pretty good. It’s seductive. It’s satisfying.”
Cal State Fullerton, where Senn teaches as an Adjunct Professor | Photo by CSUF News
“I put all of myself into my work. With teaching, it’s a little like a performance. But… I think about teaching art history like I am...telling...other people about what I think is interesting or cool. And then I give them all facts and basic information that I can find or that I know about relating to those things that I think are interesting or cool and then I let them, you know, kind of come to their own ideas or conclusions about that. And having debates about difference in opinion is also really fun, I think. It helps me kind of stay open and learn and it also helps them stay open and learn. So, I’ve put myself very openly into most things that I do but teaching [I do so] especially.”
“I don’t feel like I have a chip on my shoulder, but...I’ve had students” she chuckles, “say that I do. Which is so hard. People have opinions about...you as a person and you’re supposed to, like, change based on what they think. Okay, so, if my students say that I have a chip on my shoulder, I would have to say that I think that my chip is...feminist...in spirit. I am pretty angry—deep down—not, like, regularly. Deep down, I’m pretty angry at the cards that women have been dealt over the years. I think it’s a shitty hand.”
She pauses for a moment in thought. “I just get a bum deal most of the time and it really bums me out; so much so, that, um, when I was pregnant with my son and I first found out that he was a he, that he was going to be a boy, I kind of had a melt down and was really angry and I had no idea why. I had to go see a therapist about it. And we figured out that I was really angry at the patriarchy and angry that women were basically forgotten in history. And, you know, by giving...our sons their father’s names, we erase women and that makes me really angry and it makes me also a little...afraid...that I’ll be forgotten. And I was so looking forward to, like, raising this, like, feminist army of” she chuckles, “strong and dominating women that I just hadn’t even thought about how to make a strong and dominating feminist man from scratch before. But! I’m working on it. And he is going to be a dominating, feminist, awesome, female-loving man.”
“Difficult days can come in a variety of shapes and colors, right? Some of my difficult days have to do with my baby; how fussy he’s being, how much or how little he’ll let me sleep or work or feel like I’m a human being outside of him, being with him. But the juggling, I guess, is more common for most of my difficult days. A difficult day looks like sleeping three hours...spending most of the night awake trying to comfort a screaming infant, not showering for, like, four days, not being able to drink coffee because I’m nursing and the baby can’t have caffeine, still having to do four or five jobs worth of work at some point in a twenty-four hour period; usually after the baby is asleep at night when Husband is home and can keep an eye on him while I’m doing work downstairs in my” she gestures around, “office… And still having to eat food and wash my face, brush my teeth, and communicate with others. That’s a hard day. That happens a lot, actually.”
LCAD, where Senn teaches as an Adjunct Professor | Photo by Laguna College of Art + Design
“There are a lot of times, now that I’m a working mom, that I have to...just suck it up; I don’t have an option. It’s not… I can’t be shitty...at this… I can’t be a shitty mom. That would… That would be terrible. That would be, like… That would never happen. I would never let that happen. I will not be a shitty mom. I will not slack off on my Mom Job. And I will not slack off with teaching because I love it and..it’s so rewarding. And every exhibition I’ve put up is a reflection on me...as a person and as a curator and as a professional. So, there’s no fucking way I’m going to let that go down. [...] Since becoming a mom, I have not written much. And I don’t plan to because I’m fucking stressed and I’m strapped for time. [...] But I can’t slack off on the big jobs. So, the emotions that I use to push myself through? I guess pride is involved… I don’t know. What’s another emotion involved in that...? Yeah, I guess pride… I don't ever want to be disappointed in myself… I can’t remember the last time I felt disappointed in myself but... I didn’t like it. And I don’t plan on feeling that way again; especially not when it comes to this.”
She admits that pride and insecurity play a big part in her multiple careers in general. “I have to be proud, at least overtly, in all of my jobs. I have to be confident and...solid...at all times: in teaching, in curating, and in writing. There’s no room for doubt...on the surface. On the inside, it’s very doubtful. I am insecure in a lot of ways. I try not to let that get to me. I try not to...get too deep in that because” she shakes her head gently and fiddles with her glasses, “it doesn’t do any good. But teaching, like I said, is a performance. And performing...without a character is...is very vulnerable and it makes me feel...very insecure at times. I’ve got, you know, sixty-plus faces staring at me, judging every word I say, every word I say incorrectly, every feeling I express, every thought that comes into my head, every dumb joke that I accidentally say… I mean, its-it’s hard. It’s a very insecure feeling, being a teacher sometimes.
Senn Documenting an Exhibition | Photo by Brea Art Gallery
“[And] curating [...] is so personal to me and I… Sometimes I feel really insecure at the openings [when] people are first seeing the work and the show all together and, like... I know there’s things like… You know, “If I had more money, if I had more time, if I had more help...I could do other stuff, I could do bigger things…” But, with what I’ve been given and what I have available to me, you know, my choices can be limited sometimes and that’s...that’s hard. I don’t like being judged, but of course, my three professions are all outward expression-based works and so that makes me...at the mercy of others or their judgment...sadly.”
“I didn’t used to lean on people [...] But, with my gallery stuff, my husband helps me a lot. And, actually...my last serious relationship was also a helper-person. So, they’ve both helped me put on shows a little bit. I would still do a majority of the work and they would come in and help a little bit. However, when I got pregnant, I was unable to do a lot of the things that, normally, I would do. So, my husband really stepped up and has, since then, taken the reins of the physical installation in the gallery: hanging works, doing the lighting, doing the heavy lifting stuff...because I can’t. So that’s… I do lean on him quite a bit now.”
“In curating (and in writing) ... When I started doing it a little more full-time...a revelation, I guess you could call it, would be that I realized that I don’t have to try so hard...” she lowers her voice just a half-octave, “and I can still be really good at it. Like, it’s a natural…inclination for me. I write well. I’ve not taken any writing classes, but I write very well. And people keep paying me to do that. And curating, I also...am very good at... But it’s all just instinctual. I have not taken any classes [for] it. And I didn’t realize that I was very good at it until I started doing it a lot; both, writing and curating. I was like, “Oh, I’m actually pretty good at this.” Like, that was a revelation...of sorts. Not really. Maybe?”
Fault Lines Reading Flyer by Senn
“I mean, I get surprised at my work a lot. Like, shit happens and I’m like, “Oh shit! I’m surprised!” But the work itself? I mean, curating or teaching or writing? I think that teaching surprises me more than any other jobs because...there’s so many other people involved. My students are phenomenal human beings and what they remember, what they gain, the insights they come up with, what their...racial thoughts, their ideas...those things surprise me. Those things, I love. That’s… Shit, that’s what makes it all worth it.”
“Human imagination is wild. It is so inspiring and amazing and extraordinary and I just think that...” she takes a breath. “The fact that we are the only species that makes art… Consciously makes art! It’s magical. It’s so interesting. It’s so cool. [...] There are things in this world that are magical… And that [also] makes it all...worthwhile, I think.”
“So, I keep applying to PhD programs, unsuccessfully. They keep denying me. That’s fine. I’m taking a break from applying and I’ll reapply after Baby gets a little bit bigger… But I’ve applied, like, four times. And my dissertation idea keeps changing (they want to know what you want to do your dissertation on before you’re even in the program, which I think is ridiculous). But it makes you think about what your long-term research goal is, right? And I always think about, like, what can I spend the next twenty years of my life dedicated to? If I had to, if I needed it to, you know? This is going to become your specialty...for your whole career...for the rest of your life. What would it be?
"So, this last round, I figured out...what I’m most interested in...is the way that the brain, the human brain, reacts with art. The fact that it, you know, helps us make art, that we get ideas to make art...the fact that looking at art is actually healthy for you. Like, it makes you a...better, healthy...person. Making art is very healthy; it can help ease all kinds of issues—physical and mental issues… So there are all of these questions that I have. [...] What impact or relationship do they have? You know? Like, what impact does art really have on the human brain and human...existence? So that, I think, is the larger kind of question, the larger goal that I am constantly working with or through; what kind of impact does this art or that art or this art have on...people? And why? That’s what drives me to look at art. That’s what drives me when I make art (which is not very often). That’s what drives me when I am teaching about art, when I am curating… I mean, you name it. That’s kind of a bigger… I want people to think about that. I want people...to consider it.”
Check out more of her work on her website.
This interview has been edited for clarity and length.
